Jedi Mind Tricks Elaborate On Stoupe Departure, Beats Were Submitted

Exclusive: Vinnie Paz calls his longtime musical complement "wishy-washy" as the Philadelphia mainstay moves forward. Jus Allah notes that he hadn't seen his band-mate in years.

Philadelphia, Pennsylvania area act Jedi Mind Tricks has been known for the last 15-plus years for their consistent raw and rugged Hip Hop records. Having sold over 450,000 records on a worldwide level, JMT's Violence Begets Violence will be their seventh studio album and first project that will not include producer, Stoupe. The news came jarring to some, as Stoupe had complemented Vinnie Paz's abrasive vocal style with diverse sample choices, softer strings and keys, and a chemistry that made the group an underground Hip Hop stalwart throughout the '00s.

Although the fans may interpret things one way, JMT's Vinnie Paz and Jus Allah spoke with DX about Stoupe's departure, and why Violence Begets Violence won't miss a beat.

Why Jedi Mind Tricks And Stoupe Have Parted Ways

HipHopDX:  A lot of fans have shared their disappointment on realizing that Stoupe did not contribute to Violence Begets Violence, what are your thoughts on the situation and how are things with you and Stoupe? 

Jus Allah: As far as that situation, I haven't seen Stoupe in years. So as far as him being apart of this record, you know, he gave a couple of beats to me and [Vinnie Paz]. We agreed on maybe two of them, but they didn't make the final cut for the album. We're trying to make hardcore music, and he's still on [Jedi Mind Tricks 2006 song] "Razorblade Salvation" type deal, that's cool for what it is, but we're trying to keep it rugged right now. We're still growing and Stoupe is growing too. He hasn't been with us; hasn't hung out with us; so he doesn't know where our heads are at.

We're back in war mode. We want our spot back. It's not a game no more. You just have a lot of people who talk randomly and recklessly about our music, but [there is] never an artist who never says anything about our music because they understand what we put into making every track. But you know you get a fan that's like 15 [years old], who gets a little cocky and [begins] saying what we should be doing. We've been a group for 15, 20 years. How are we gonna let people dictate what we are doing? We understand what's best for us as a group and for our fans.    

Vinnie Paz: For me and Jus [Allah], it's business as usual. [Stoupe is] on the Internet making it seem like it's a lot going on, but as far as we're concerned, we're working. I can't sit around and wait for someone anymore; this is what I do for a living.  The whole time it's been hard dealing with [Stoupe]. With me, one monkey don't stop one show.  He's been wishy-washy since the beginning. I don't have a choice, this is all I know. Shit needs to come out.

Vinnie Paz & Jus Allah Explain Making Violence Begets Violence

DX: On the album there is an array of producers that you guys brought on for this project. Without Stoupe, where did put you guys when it came to create and record this project? 

Jus Allah: We've been doing this a long time and we know a lot of people that want to work with us who are hungry. A lot of these kids were on the same page as us. It's good to bring people up and at the same time build.  It's a few cats on their that are really repping, and give us the heat. When they come to us with beats they come to us with their best. It's a growing process.   

Vinnie Paz: When I was working with a lot of these cats on the records on this particular LP, I was looking for our shit to get done. I didn't need things to be done a certain way, I was looking for the records and putting them in the stash. 

DX: What's next for Jedi Mind Tricks?

Jus Allah: I just want cats to listen with an open mind. If you never heard us before or heard us before, don't compare this album with other Jedi Mind Tricks albums before now, compare it with stuff that came out this year. This is our careers now this is what we do. I bet my life on this album, nobody's fucking with it. 

Vinnie Paz:  As far as Stoupe is concerned, talk to him. We're still doing incredible music. If anything, there is no beef. We're doing the shows, the interviews, we're the ones getting asked the questions. So ask him what the problem is. We're here to make music. If you don't got positive shit to say to me, don't say it to me. What's next, we're off to Australia [to tour]. Fans out there have been coming to our shows around the world; so we're going to go out there to show them love.   

Follow Vinnie Paz and Jus Allah on Twitter (@Vinnie_Paz) and (@JusAllahMMA)

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58 Comments

  • Tommy

    Honestly, alot has change between jmt over the years, and jus isnt talking shit about stoupe, he is just stating that vinnie and jus arent on the same page with stoupe, if you listen to stoupe's music today, he is on a whole different page, he has been doing more trip hop type beats and its alot different compared to his classic albums, he hasnt gone soft, but "razorblade salvation" type beat is not a war rugged beat, its not the same like "muerte", "heavenly divine" or "blood runs cold", but i really wish they can go back like it use to be, raw, rough and dark......

  • Benedict

    I stopped reading the article when they were done talking shit about Stoupe. shit went down hill when Jus rejoined JMT. I never skipped more tracks off a JMT album then History of Violence. I would like to see an interview with Stoupe himself and hear what he has to say.

  • Ian

    Time to hang it up Paz, plain and simple. Your grasping at straws now. Jus Allah is just hopping on the hate wagon. He's got nerve to sit there acting like he has been involved all along. This whole thing of them splitting is personal, who are they trying to kid. And to the person who said that Vinnie is from the suburbs from PA, not the city, youre right, he is. And where he is from is not a "hood".

  • Former JMT Fan

    First off I don't think Jus should be saying a damn thing. His ass was MIA while Vinnie and Stoupe were still pushing forward, so I think he needs to sit back and keep his mouth shut. Secondly, this isn't a JMT album as far as I'm concerned. No Stoupe production is a great loss for Vinnie, and I think its time to put the JMT name to rest. How can you be JMT without the signature sound of Stoupe...you can't its just not the same. This shit should just be Vinnie's second solo album. JMT had a great run and with Stoupe out of the picture I think its time to retire Jedi Mind Tricks, and pick up a new group name. I own every JMT album (even the Psycho-Social joint) and mostly everything in between (ex. Stoupe's Decalogue & Season of the Assassin). From the my point of view this is a bullshit ass move, and tons of fans will not approve of an album without the enemy of mankind. I'm not even sure if I want to keep buying any Enemy Soil albums (Outerspace, Doap Nixon, AOTP, Reef, and the occasional King Syze). In the end it boils down to being loyal to your squad that helped you get were you are now, and to the fans that supported you throughout the years. Peace The Fuck Out, Former JMT Fan

    • Jorge

      Stoupe never made music for any of the other artists you mentioned. Why stop listening to them if you like their music?

  • Brizz

    I think people reaching to take sides in something non existing beef here. Personally i think its hard to call this jmt without stoupe but that doesent make it so. VBV will probably go hard as f##k anyways. To say vinnie fell off after just releasing sota and hmk is just wrong. End of days is an instant classic and stoupe doing a dope thing with vespertina, bet they will reunite in the future and for now it is what it is. Im gonna give vbv a good listen but it wont be a preorder now when stoupes not around, if it still bangs im bying, if not on to the next. PZ.

  • Dark Sith

    Just listened to Dutch - "A Bright Cold Day" album & the production is there, it's just a creative difference, but Vinnie is on some bullshit, fuck Jus he left years ago & Stoupe WAS Jedi Mind, so in essence there really is no JMT without Stoupe, but yet there is without Jus.

  • Anonymous

    I just hope that hip hop dont lose Stoupe for good over this, I would lov to hear a cat like Illogic make an album with stoupe, or even an Old school legend like Rakim or somebody like that, dude has mad talent and was wasting his time with JMT and their repetitive lyrics

  • Nick

    I've got it on good authority that Vinnie is one of the hardest individuals to work with in the Hip Hop game. It seems pretty apparent that he'll burn anyone at the drop of a hat. Case-and-point: Drew Dollars, Chief Kamachi, Jus Allah and now Stoupe. They've clearly been prepping for this transition for quite some time given the amount of promotion that C-Lance has received. But C-Lance is no Stoupe. Sad to admit this, but Vin's interests in Hip Hop seem more monetary than artistic. I'm POSITIVE he and Stoupe had issues in that regard.

    • Geno

      Dam. Now this is making me look at Babygrande in a whole new light. There are always two sides two every story.

    • EZ

      what? vinnie didn't create AOTP and put like 10-12 rappers on? vinnie doesn't invite other emcees on tour and create opportunities for his peoples? vinnie been holding the flag up forever man. his solo album was stacked. re-read the article. vinnie was dealing with stoupe through the INTERNET, waiting for beats. it doesn't seem like stoupe was making it a priority to work with vinnie, so vinnie got with guys that actually WANT to work with him. when JMT first started, it was a 3 man team. stoupe doesn't go on the road, and now jus is saying stoupe doesn't even hang out anymore. i love stoupe, but it's stoupe that's difficult to deal with. he's fucking bizarre man. most cats with that much talent are. don't hang this on vinnie, because it looks like stoupe ditched them. vinnie showing a little frustration because all's he's hearing is "where's stoupe?" and stoupe hasn't been around for a long time. ask stoupe. i hope somebody does, dx should try and do that. i figured stoupe could do both his side projects, along with JMT, but obviously his focus is elsewhere. this is how vinnie and jus make a living, they gotta keep it moving.

  • AxeMurder

    Its cray how far Vinnie fell in a few short years. Look @ the way he rapped on Violent By Design (2000) compared to Legacy of Blood (2004)...fucking unreal he was SOOO beastily

  • EddieMurrrphy

    ITS NOT THAT PEOPLE DONT KNOW WHAT TO EXPECT. WE JUST DONT WANT TO BE BORED WITH AN ALBUM THAT SOUNDS LIKE A HYBRID AOTP PROJECT MIXED WITH SOME HEAVY METAL KINGS. YOU KNOW WHAT THE FUCK IM TALKING ABOUT. THAT SOUND IS GOOD BUT ITS BORING TO BE OVERLOADED WITH IT. SORRY DEEP FAGGOTS I AM JUST DISAPPOINTED AS FUCK SEEING C-LANCE ON A JEDI MIND RELEASE.

  • Stoupe

    im a beatmaker and im sick of hip hop its wack and lame now im out im growing the fuck up as an artist

    • ian

      the whole "hate" and muslim spewing, braaaaap thing, is hagged out. Move on Stoupe, no matter what you do, you are guaranteed more success. These guys arent going to be doing this in their 50's. Who will listen to them? There is up and coming all the time, no one is going to want to listen to the old heads with cracked up voices. For every year that goes by, music will get better and better and these guys will get older and older and one day they will be standing there wondering what they are going to do. How will they retire?

    • Anonymous

      I'm with you stoupe, the game is fraudulent. Should we "keep it real" with an hateful hip hop group, or continue to grow artistically? I'll go with the latter, the game is wack. Too many ballhuggers and fake gankstaz. Do you stoupe, I'm fucking with Dutch harder than JMT's overrated music.

    • SpikeyJamez

      I don't get it, there are still rappers out there making good music and continue to experiment new idea and suddenly you ditched the genre? Why?

  • eggtree

    yall act like jmt can't put out dope shit without stoupe. s.o.t.a and heavy metal kings were both dope albums from vin and guess what, no stoupe. its not like you don't know what type of shit they're about to come on this album. i am a fan of them and will be checkin this shit out regardless. people gone soft these days

    • Anonymous

      paz is philly jack. you'd be hard pressed to find a rapper that's done more independently in philly than vinnie paz. that dude is official, and been official. check the resume. check his solo shit. he has videos that he comes out of pocket for, getting close to a million views on youtube. jedi mind shit has always been violent, hard, head nod shit, that explores science and life. look at all the emcees paz rolls with. apathy, celph, reef, 3 emcees that are killing shit right now, that were put in a position to win by paz. false flagging? you're soft. rap wasn't always something pussies wanted to do. a lot of emcees started rapping cuz they didn't wanna get caught in the hustle. his music promotes violence and hate? man. i guess you spar in the gym to some pussy shit that uplifts your spirits. anger is just as genuine as any other emotion.

    • Anonymous

      and i'm from the hood, we don't like that bullshit in our hoods, only when nessesary... this dude worships and glorifies violence, but ain't even from south philly like he claims... hmmm another suburbanite claiming the hood to promote his bullshit...ok. don't come to the hood homie;)

    • Anonymous

      vinnie ain't showing real hip hop love, he's false flagging as an islamic extremist but in reality pushing nothing but the same poison everyone else is peddling in hip hop. you CANNOT compare madlib to paz, madlib does mixtapes and beats and promotes good music while paz promotes violence and hate.

    • thereal

      i fucking co-sign..this aint no Copywrite in the early 2000's and now..vinnie never fell off..earlier he might have sounded like a wanabe wutang memeber but he's more of a beast..telling you like it is..and for one if cats complain about monetary value..vinnie is one of those like madlib who shows that the real hip hop we love can make money too..cats gotta eat...you think beats fall out of the sky....all projects this dude gets involved in he makes em classic...we havent heard the otherside of stoupe but he aint God....VINNIE STAYS KILLING SHIT

  • Anonymous

    Vinnie Paz "END OF DAYS" is a straight up classic!!!!

  • @RadioRebels

    for great underground hip hop like JMT, news, discussions, and interviews with artist follow on twitter @RadioRebels

  • SutterKane

    Stoupe just lost intrest in making beats for Vinny & Jus to spew their hate speech over, lol, no offense but I mean its the truth Typical Vinny Paz Verse: 1. Praise Allah 2. Bash Christianity 3. Bash Faggots 4. Shout Out Philly 5. Holla "BBBBRRRRAAAAPPPPP" adlib And I mean that with all due respect because for what it is, thats fine, but Stoupe seems like a real creative dude to me and probably lost intrest in doing the same thing over and over, which is why his work with "Dutch" and "Vespertina" is his best work in years, thats the stuff that he's into and he gets better results that way On a Positive Note, at least there all still making music

    • Johannes Johansson

      vinnie paz songs can be predictable but it's not like we have a problem with a majority of rappers promoting Islam. you go promote traditional conservative christian capitalist american values if you want, vinnie never will. and I mean wtf, that "bRRap vinnieapathy hahaha brap" shit can get tedious at times but any enemy soil record is still better than 90% of american hiphop released today. songs about having fun in a disco, I prefer a genocide death hood gunz allah song over that shit any day

    • Anonymous

      real shit homie thanks for simplifying it...

    • 9Stories

      You forgot 6. Rap about him causing genocide and mass killing 7. Shout 'yeah motherfuckers!, ha ha ha!' I've always wanted to hear Illogic on a Stoupe track. Who do you think would blaze an Enemy of Mankind track?

    • Anonymous

      stoupe was wasting his talent with jmt he grew the fuck up i guess

    • Anonymous

      This dude hit it right on the fucking head, I agree.

  • D-Train

    I don't think there is beef as much as there is creative differences...Stoupe wasn't really motivated for this project and kept putting it off...They said he was in a creative slump as far as JMT and they ended up feeling only a few tracks...As a producer it's hard to make bangers if your ish aint tight... Personally I haven't really liked them in yrs, I liked there 90's sound.... Bronze Naz or June Marx from Twin Peril would be great producers for them, since they have a simular sounds...

  • EZ

    I see some frustration in those words. I can imagine. It is true though. Vinnie has been the guy doing all the interviews, all the shows, all the business, he's a worker. He's put everything into JMT. AOTP is proof of that. That is all Vinnie's vision. Stoupe is a fucking genius. There's always a catch to that. It seems like Stoupe has been out of the picture for some time, and Vinnie got tired of chasing Stoupe down at album time. Stoupe is one of the greatest producers to ever do it in my opinion. I think it's a shame he won't be involved in the project. But these guys are all talented as hell, and I will always support their work. Stoupe's side work has been incredible. People change with the times just like anything else. I can't wait to hear the new incarnation of JMT, a lot to live up to, and they sound confident in the fact they delivered. BTW - I DON'T THINK I'M THE ONLY JEDI MIND FAN THAT WOULD LOVE TO HEAR THE 2 TRACKS STOUPE SUBMITTED THAT DIDN'T MAKE THE CUT. MAYBE THEY CAN BE FEATURED AS BONUS TRACKS? IT WOULD BE REALLY SPECIAL IF THEY DID THAT FOR THE FANS.

    • word god

      this has to be the only comment I agree with. I fuck with ANY Jedi Mind Tricks shit, if anyone doesnt WANT to hear it, DON'T LISTEN TO IT....dudes act like they dont know what to expect from a JMT record 15 years in?

  • Dick

    This is some straight up bullshit. All this shit about Jus saying "they've" been doing this for 10-15 years when he's been on TWO fucking albums...get the fuck outta here. JMT is Stoupe and Vinny, period. R.I.P to my all time favorite group...

  • Anonymous

    Still on his "Razorblade Salvation" Stuff? fuck your vision of raw and all this fake ass shit, just go back to makin dope music

  • Anonymous

    If only we could have a time machine back to the year 2000, right when violent by design came out, maybe coulda prevented this

  • Anonymous

    I love Jedi Mind Tricks, but Vinnie is talking this 'raw' shit a bit too far, saying your bouta be perfecty fine without stoupe? No Stoupe, No JMT. Start another group and let that rest in peace

    • ic

      You do realize that A History of Violence is entirely produced by Stoupe, right? If you meant Violence begets violence, you failed. It's by far their worst project to date. The production sounds like they went back to Psycho-Social, wich is fine, but the content is nowhere near the knowledge that Ikon/Vinnie was bringing to the table at such a young age. I like their "new" flows, and I don't hate the new production, I just feel like these guys could still make their best record if they were on the Psycho-Social tip with Servants in Heaven type of production. It's a shame that it's never going to happen...

    • emma

      Sick of all of this talk about JMT being nothing without Stoupe. IMHO A History of Violence is their best work yet. Vinnie's raw, gritty voice against the soft melodies is supreme. Some of the best rap out there.

  • Anonymous

    There is no JMT without Stoupe, what in the fuck, Jus leaves & it's Vinnie & Stoupe as JMT, now Stoupe leaves & Jus & Vinnie are JMT, hot damn Vinnie is JMT all by himself, fucking bullshit.

  • G MON

    Sounds like a falling out between them and Stoupe, lots of hostility in those words. Even tho Stoupe is amazing, JMT will be fine without him, he's moved on from making rap beats, good for him, but like Vinnie said what's he suppose to do, wait around for Stoupe to finish his things? C-Lance is producing majority of the tracks on this album and this guy is the new Stoupe. He's 24, and all he does is make beats so they will be fine. Lots of ppl hating on Jus ever since he switched his flow up, i think he's the one improving lyrically and Vinnie is sliding more. Jus' rhyme schemes and just overall anger in his voice is sick.

  • R2die

    i wonder if they got any snowgoons production on the new album? their production just goes soo well with that JMT/ Army of the Pharaohs gritty sound..

  • Anonymous

    JMT is and will never be the same without Stoupe. The things stoupe has done on the side (Dutch etc), while not hiphop, have been musically superior to what Jus and Vinnie have been putting out. Goes to show how important the production was to JMT's success. Jus is not the same either. He's just trying to sound like Vinnie now (an it sounds horrible). For all intensive purposes, the group to me isnt even "Jedi Mind Tricks". JMT is a group of the past to me now.

  • Doug Nichols

    Trading Stoupe and bringing back Jus Allah reminds me of the Hornets trading Kobe for Vlade Divac.

  • Dan Ruben Nilsen Lindseth

    stoupe and vinnie had the best jmt albums, jus allah is a weak link in the crew

  • rockie

    I have zero interest in JMT without Stoupe

    • Justin

      This is so true my man. When Jus says "stoupe is still on Razorblade Salvations stuff" ....um thats top 3 fav JMT song ever to me....so looks like im checking out on this album its been a nice run

  • Gracie

    This aint right. They are shitting on their brother. That man held them down with classic production for a decade plus. You dont air him out to publicize your new album that does not include him. This is grimy. It funny how money change situation.

  • EddieMurrrphy

    Yeah wait a minute i thought Meanest Man Alive was supposed to come out. a while ago now hmm...

  • Anonymous

    Paz says ain't no beef, but him and jus kinda coming at stoupe sideways on here, stoupe is the cornerstone of JMT. Honestly, I lost interest after the legacy of blood, mainly because of Paz's extremist islamic rants, which I feel makes the community look terrible. He needs to step his content up, because that Allah gives me the right to kill mutha fuckas is stale in 2011

  • Tim Wilkens

    Stoupe was a key element to JMT but Paz's solo joint was so good I have faith

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